The Best and Worst Growing Products.

Ummmmm...no.

Lmao.

You guys should not make such absolute statements like "Worst
Almost anything in a bottle, most of them work great but it's mainly poison or overpriced garbage being sold to the masses"

How is a chain of salts "poison?"

I've grown everything from full organic, living soil to completely salt based hydro.

I would bet a 1000$ that you could not tell the difference if I plopped down two jars of the same strain, grown in organic vs a clean well thought out hydro recipe. Its all about providing what the plant needs, in the correct amount and at the right time.

Proper dry and cure mean the world.


I was just talking to another member here about this very subject.

You guys on the Organic Bandwagon are starting to get really annoying with the mis-information campaign.


Absolute statements drive me crazy.

Ok, off my high horse.


Just for good measure:

Best products:
Composted feces
Composted vegetable matter
Fish guts!
Crab meal
And.........
GENERAL HYDRO FLORA SERIES!

Common sense is the best product out there. Hard to find though.
:D

**Edit to add: while I quoted 519organics, i have seen several similar posts. Two posts above him MedM makes a similarly laughable statement.. I just want to state that I am not attacking anyone of you or your grow styles, beliefs or methods. I just feel that incorrect, absolute statements do more harm than good in our community and that an open mind is crucial to growth. Respect and love to all my MNS family.**
 
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I'm loving Jack's Professional Hydro 5-12-26 + Calcium nitrate (15.5-0-0)
I do love growing organic, but not indoors. Until i can grow safely outdoors, it's going to be salts. That's ultimately what the plants absorb.

Jack's +calcium nitrate is complete nutrition end to end veg to harvest... However I do cut the calcium nitrate after the stretch and feed the jacks + biomin calcium.
 
Lmao.

You guys should not make such absolute statements like "Worst
Almost anything in a bottle, most of them work great but it's mainly poison or overpriced garbage being sold to the masses"

How is a chain of salts "poison?"


I've grown everything from full organic, living soil to completely salt based hydro.

I would bet a 1000$ that you could not tell the difference if I plopped down two jars of the same strain, grown in organic vs a clean well thought out hydro recipe. Its all about providing what the plant needs, in the correct amount and at the right time.

Proper dry and cure mean the world.


I was just talking to another member here about this very subject.

You guys on the Organic Bandwagon are starting to get really annoying with the mis-information campaign.


Absolute statements drive me crazy.

Ok, off my high horse.


Just for good measure:

Best products:
Composted feces
Composted vegetable matter
Fish guts!
Crab meal
And.........
GENERAL HYDRO FLORA SERIES!

Common sense is the best product out there. Hard to find though.
:D

**Edit to add: while I quoted 519organics, i have seen several similar posts. Two posts above him MedM makes a similarly laughable statement.. I just want to state that I am not attacking anyone of you or your grow styles, beliefs or methods. I just feel that incorrect, absolute statements do more harm than good in our community and that an open mind is crucial to growth. Respect and love to all my MNS family.**

That's fine bro I don't feel attcked I have thicker skin that that now, I probably should have been more specific in my post when I talk about poison I mainly refer to miracle grow products and the likes, regular salt lines I still feel is overpriced garbage and nothing will change my mind, probably just my inner cheap ass talking

99% of the cannabis I have tried with salt base nute regiments I can tell, maybe it's just shity grow practices, but I also only smoke flower from a handful of growers that I've been to there grows, and swap ideas with, im not trying to diss anyone's grow style to each their own, I just feel strongly about massive markups on bottles nute lines, hell for the price of Fox farm trio I can build a no till soil that will outlast my grow license
 
"Massive markups" are not exclusively liquid salt formulations. Plenty of organic ingredients are marked up too.

Jack's is about the cheapest, high quality line you can find.
 
"Massive markups" are not exclusively liquid salt formulations. Plenty of organic ingredients are marked up too.

Jack's is about the cheapest, high quality line you can find.

Don't even get me started on liquid organics and markup lol compost tea in a bottle 129.99, brew your own 56 cents after initial startup fee, not exact figures either just an example haha,

Another product I'm using for the first time and currently really liking is the air pot grabbed a 5gallon just to test out and so far I like it in veg we will see when flower time comes
 
I’m having trouble getting my tea to foam up I am using a 5 gal bucket three air stones one attached to a 5-15gal pump and two attached to a 40-60 gal pump I’m using tap water after I bubble it for 24 hours 2cups worm casting 1/2 cup bat guano and 40ml coconut water per gallon. Any suggestions would be appreciated @519
 
I’m having trouble getting my tea to foam up I am using a 5 gal bucket three air stones one attached to a 5-15gal pump and two attached to a 40-60 gal pump I’m using tap water after I bubble it for 24 hours 2cups worm casting 1/2 cup bat guano and 40ml coconut water per gallon. Any suggestions would be appreciated @519

Are you adding mollases or cane sugar those microbes need food to reproduce
 
I’m having trouble getting my tea to foam up I am using a 5 gal bucket three air stones one attached to a 5-15gal pump and two attached to a 40-60 gal pump I’m using tap water after I bubble it for 24 hours 2cups worm casting 1/2 cup bat guano and 40ml coconut water per gallon. Any suggestions would be appreciated @519

hi T have you tried with rain water ? you might still have some nasties left in your tap water and also temp are important aswell
 
hi T have you tried with rain water ? you might still have some nasties left in your tap water and also temp are important aswell


If your tap water is chlorine based a 24 hour bubble will be sufficient, but if your city uses chloramine than you'll have to use distilled, Ro, or rain water, as chloramine will not evaporate like chlorine does, something to look into
 
Hey triplep,

I spoke with Microbeman about my compost tea a little because I had the opposite issue: Too much foam.

He explained to me that this is likely from the malted barley I used in my ACT which basically no longer makes it an ACT but more of an innoculant tea for boosting the microbe herd (or starting it up).

Either way, to my surprise, he said that a basic ACT of just worm castings and molasses (what 519 said is correct by the way, the lil ones need a food source to multiply, hence molasses is important), is not necessarily supposed to foam a hell of a lot.

Could also basically not foam at all. That doesn't necessarily mean the microbes are not multiplying. So don't worry too much about the foam.

As an analogy: People sometimes get distraught when their organic soil mix doesn't produce a layer of mycellium (I think that's what it's called, the fuzzy layer on top of the soil). But while it is ideal if the soil produces that mycellium layer, it is not an indicator that the micro-/fungal herd in the soil isn't developing if it doesn't show. Sometimes the fuzzy mycellium layer also just stays for a very short time before it fades away/breaks down again and you might just miss it because you didn't check in the meantime. It is by no means an indicator for the soil mix being flawed or something. Just under ideal circumstances, you would see it.



@blowingupjake and the whole hydro vs. organics discussion

I was the dude speaking with jake about it via PM before he posted that.

And I am entirely, whole-heartedly convinced of organic growing methods.

That being said, I also whole-heartedly agree with Jake that dealing in absolutes is for the Sith ;)
Things change, things develop and even though I would still be convinced my organic bud would taste, smoke and smell better than his hydro bud, I would not be surprised or call it an outerworldly claim if he said "bro, you probably won't be able to tell the difference".

He also said that after drying, straight off the plant, the organic bud he grew was noticeably nicer to smoke and you could clearly tell it apart from his hydro bud. But after a few months of curing, he was no longer able to tell them apart. And I absolutely believe him.
The dry and cure are very, very, VERY important in all this and the main reason why commercial bud is often crap just as street bud is. Because in both settings, there is, if any, a minimal cure.

While gaining experience in this hobby of ours, I more and more realize that we are not dealing with night and day differences between growing methods, strains, this and that.
We are dealing with nuances here.

And while your standard, poorly grown, basically not cured, hydro bud that you get on the street might be a night and day difference to my organic bud, Jake's hydro bud could very well be just nuances different and any ever so slightly weaker terpene profile or slightly harsher smoke might be offset by slightly higher potency or weight or whatever.

Like most things in life it is not as clear cut as "this is black and this is white".

Most of the stuff is just an endless scale of gray in between if you look hard enough.

So I agree with him, shouldn't throw out so many absolutes, especially since most of us probably can't compare all the stuff from personal experience and, like me, go more by "hey, I researched this, tried it, works for me, this is great. I researched that, haven't tried it because my research told me about potential pitfalls but since the other thing worked so well for me, I'm just going to confirm that the other stuff is crap".

That's bias and we shouldn't discourage someone from forming their own opinion due to it.

Stay frosty my friends
 
Hey triplep,

I spoke with Microbeman about my compost tea a little because I had the opposite issue: Too much foam.

He explained to me that this is likely from the malted barley I used in my ACT which basically no longer makes it an ACT but more of an innoculant tea for boosting the microbe herd (or starting it up).

Either way, to my surprise, he said that a basic ACT of just worm castings and molasses (what 519 said is correct by the way, the lil ones need a food source to multiply, hence molasses is important), is not necessarily supposed to foam a hell of a lot.

Could also basically not foam at all. That doesn't necessarily mean the microbes are not multiplying. So don't worry too much about the foam.

As an analogy: People sometimes get distraught when their organic soil mix doesn't produce a layer of mycellium (I think that's what it's called, the fuzzy layer on top of the soil). But while it is ideal if the soil produces that mycellium layer, it is not an indicator that the micro-/fungal herd in the soil isn't developing if it doesn't show. Sometimes the fuzzy mycellium layer also just stays for a very short time before it fades away/breaks down again and you might just miss it because you didn't check in the meantime. It is by no means an indicator for the soil mix being flawed or something. Just under ideal circumstances, you would see it.



@blowingupjake and the whole hydro vs. organics discussion

I was the dude speaking with jake about it via PM before he posted that.

And I am entirely, whole-heartedly convinced of organic growing methods.

That being said, I also whole-heartedly agree with Jake that dealing in absolutes is for the Sith ;)
Things change, things develop and even though I would still be convinced my organic bud would taste, smoke and smell better than his hydro bud, I would not be surprised or call it an outerworldly claim if he said "bro, you probably won't be able to tell the difference".

He also said that after drying, straight off the plant, the organic bud he grew was noticeably nicer to smoke and you could clearly tell it apart from his hydro bud. But after a few months of curing, he was no longer able to tell them apart. And I absolutely believe him.
The dry and cure are very, very, VERY important in all this and the main reason why commercial bud is often crap just as street bud is. Because in both settings, there is, if any, a minimal cure.

While gaining experience in this hobby of ours, I more and more realize that we are not dealing with night and day differences between growing methods, strains, this and that.
We are dealing with nuances here.

And while your standard, poorly grown, basically not cured, hydro bud that you get on the street might be a night and day difference to my organic bud, Jake's hydro bud could very well be just nuances different and any ever so slightly weaker terpene profile or slightly harsher smoke might be offset by slightly higher potency or weight or whatever.

Like most things in life it is not as clear cut as "this is black and this is white".

Most of the stuff is just an endless scale of gray in between if you look hard enough.

So I agree with him, shouldn't throw out so many absolutes, especially since most of us probably can't compare all the stuff from personal experience and, like me, go more by "hey, I researched this, tried it, works for me, this is great. I researched that, haven't tried it because my research told me about potential pitfalls but since the other thing worked so well for me, I'm just going to confirm that the other stuff is crap".

That's bias and we shouldn't discourage someone from forming their own opinion due to it.

Stay frosty my friends

Great post!well said
 
I'm loving Jack's Professional Hydro 5-12-26 + Calcium nitrate (15.5-0-0)
I do love growing organic, but not indoors. Until i can grow safely outdoors, it's going to be salts. That's ultimately what the plants absorb.

Jack's +calcium nitrate is complete nutrition end to end veg to harvest... However I do cut the calcium nitrate after the stretch and feed the jacks + biomin calcium.

I just switched to Jack's and am using the 321 method. I'm diluting my res down to about 690 ppm and the Colombians seem to be loving it. I want to reduce N in mid-late flower, but don't understand Jack's + biomin calcium. What's that?
 
If your tap water is chlorine based a 24 hour bubble will be sufficient, but if your city uses chloramine than you'll have to use distilled, Ro, or rain water, as chloramine will not evaporate like chlorine does, something to look into

A pinch of Potassium or Sodium metabisulphite (Camden tablet) will sort Chloramine and chloride instantly,
when brewing I would use around 1/8th of a teaspoon to 6 (Imp.) gallons,
although I understand less works.

I can't find the references for the chemistry at the moment but any competent brewer will confirm it works.
 
I just switched to Jack's and am using the 321 method. I'm diluting my res down to about 690 ppm and the Colombians seem to be loving it. I want to reduce N in mid-late flower, but don't understand Jack's + biomin calcium. What's that?

Hey Marcus just a note here about the 321 scheme for Jack's: I believe that formula for running it was designed before they upped the Magnesium. So for me, I am using 1:1 jacks:calcium nitrate until I am way into flowering. The only deficiencies that I have seen were calcium spotting on some of the black widow I ran.
 
Miracle Grow stinks. As does ALL chemical synthetic junk.

Bagged soil mulch that is very good is Happy Frog Ocean Forest & Dr. Earth's Potting Soil. I use them 50/50 when I put in my garden mulch every spring.

I like blood meal & humic acid as well.

In liquid ferts I like Eleanor's VF-11 & Extreme Juice. Also the Extreme brand of Rose Food for solid fert.

Horse poo & alfalfa hay in the mulch bin with humic acid to help with composting. Can't beat earth worms either.

These of course, are not the only good ones, there a lot of good brands out there. I don't order this kind of stuff online very often, so I have to go local. I like buying local anyway.

mM
Me too. I use Coast of Maine Lobster compost, bales of alfalfa, red wrigglers, Azomite, greensand, kelp ( from the beach! Oak leaves, mostly. I use the coast of Maine brand organic dry fertilizer. I like Fiskars pruning scissors, a how, Jackson HD wheelbarrow, and some mycorrhiza powder
 
Always had luck with Fox Farms and Earth Juice brands.
Not so much luck with the higher priced big name brand stuff.
Always mixed my own soil...bone meal, blood meal, worm shit, bat shit, dolomite lime, perlite....the usual suspects.
 
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