My Gelato Experiment, Ebb N Flow Gavita 1700e

MImedpatient

Well-known member
Wow thanks! Mind blowing about the GH liquids but makes since with my results so far. I will definitely check out vegbloom. You say it has organic additives? That won't be an issue in my flood to drain recirculating system would it? It would be awesome if I could stop buying Orca.
You should contact veg bloom and ask. my friend who is doing DWC s testing out a new base formula for them. I personally, think the base, and life should be totally fine
after messing around with the shine and stackswell; the pk boost and cal mag; I don't think I would put those in a reservoir as the shine made a scum from the organics separating out of solution, and the stackswell smells kind of like a rotten corned beef sandwich after sitting bubbling in solution over night. I assume as the calcium and magnesium gluconate are being broken down and processed by the bacteria I add, and the enzyme powder I use into its stinkier breakdown products. after watering it in, my grow room and flower room never smell this way.

if you are using orca I do not see why the Life product wouldn't be an adequate replacement. It is an iffy situation w/ products like orca and life in hydro. do the mycorrhizae actually colonize the roots in hydroponics? becasue lots of research says that the bacteria are the dominant micro organisms in hydroponics.

before you switch, send an email to the companies that make tribus, Mammoth Microbes, and EM1 to see if you can get some samples. my one friend who uses the GH liquids on flood tables had the flavor from the fertilizer go down. EM1 is basically pickling bacteria and some other micro friends. and Him and I use it at 5ml/gallon.

. tribus is 3 of the most common soil bacteria species cultured to more happily live in a liquid medium if I understood them right. I use this at .5ml/gallon

and the mammoth P Microbes are 4 or 5 phosphorous solubizing bacteria species that help prevent phosphorus lockout from over feeding, and make happy fun time enzymes that your plant can use to take up phosporus more efficiently, and tests have shown up to a 16% yield increase in otherwise optimized systems. I notice most varieties in a side by side have denser flowers, and the yeild is a little bigger on most varieties, with a few showing visually bigger yields. I use this at .5ml/gallon

I know I speak words that people don't like, but check to see if there is a store near you using hawthorne instead of sunlight supply as their distributor. the 1 hawthorne store in my area has most products set 25-50% cheaper than the ocean of stores that get from sunlight supply. for example, 25 pounds of Ro/Soft base is 250 before tax at the Hawthorne store, it is 350 dollars at the sunlight supply , store a quarter mile down the road from them. the store around the corner from me, in the suburbs, has it at 450. my friend who uses the GH liquids paid 25 dollars more for each of the 2.5 gallon jugs at the hawthorne store than he pays for EACH GALLON JUG of fertilizer at the sunlight supply stores. It could be opposite where you are. sunlight could be the upstart fighting Hawthorne dominance.
 

Stoffel

Member
You should contact veg bloom and ask. my friend who is doing DWC s testing out a new base formula for them. I personally, think the base, and life should be totally fine
after messing around with the shine and stackswell; the pk boost and cal mag; I don't think I would put those in a reservoir as the shine made a scum from the organics separating out of solution, and the stackswell smells kind of like a rotten corned beef sandwich after sitting bubbling in solution over night. I assume as the calcium and magnesium gluconate are being broken down and processed by the bacteria I add, and the enzyme powder I use into its stinkier breakdown products. after watering it in, my grow room and flower room never smell this way.

if you are using orca I do not see why the Life product wouldn't be an adequate replacement. It is an iffy situation w/ products like orca and life in hydro. do the mycorrhizae actually colonize the roots in hydroponics? becasue lots of research says that the bacteria are the dominant micro organisms in hydroponics.

before you switch, send an email to the companies that make tribus, Mammoth Microbes, and EM1 to see if you can get some samples. my one friend who uses the GH liquids on flood tables had the flavor from the fertilizer go down. EM1 is basically pickling bacteria and some other micro friends. and Him and I use it at 5ml/gallon.

. tribus is 3 of the most common soil bacteria species cultured to more happily live in a liquid medium if I understood them right. I use this at .5ml/gallon

and the mammoth P Microbes are 4 or 5 phosphorous solubizing bacteria species that help prevent phosphorus lockout from over feeding, and make happy fun time enzymes that your plant can use to take up phosporus more efficiently, and tests have shown up to a 16% yield increase in otherwise optimized systems. I notice most varieties in a side by side have denser flowers, and the yeild is a little bigger on most varieties, with a few showing visually bigger yields. I use this at .5ml/gallon

I know I speak words that people don't like, but check to see if there is a store near you using hawthorne instead of sunlight supply as their distributor. the 1 hawthorne store in my area has most products set 25-50% cheaper than the ocean of stores that get from sunlight supply. for example, 25 pounds of Ro/Soft base is 250 before tax at the Hawthorne store, it is 350 dollars at the sunlight supply , store a quarter mile down the road from them. the store around the corner from me, in the suburbs, has it at 450. my friend who uses the GH liquids paid 25 dollars more for each of the 2.5 gallon jugs at the hawthorne store than he pays for EACH GALLON JUG of fertilizer at the sunlight supply stores. It could be opposite where you are. sunlight could be the upstart fighting Hawthorne dominance.
I have read this post 10 times and I'll probably read it another 20! I will definitely call them and have a chat first. My house smelling like rotten corn beef doesn't sound all that appealing however.

Do you have any source materials I can read or is this all trial and error I your part? I definitely notice a difference in seedling/veg with the Orca but honestly I don't think it's a big improvement like when I was in soil. I didn't know that bacteria beat out Microbes in hydro that's good info for.me to look into.

The Mammoth P Microbes sound like little pot farmers just trying to do there part. You've gotten me really interested in organic hydroponics. Not looking forward to the smells.

Thanks for the help and info!
Stoffel
 

wisp

Active member
I have read this post 10 times and I'll probably read it another 20! I will definitely call them and have a chat first. My house smelling like rotten corn beef doesn't sound all that appealing however.

Do you have any source materials I can read or is this all trial and error I your part? I definitely notice a difference in seedling/veg with the Orca but honestly I don't think it's a big improvement like when I was in soil. I didn't know that bacteria beat out Microbes in hydro that's good info for.me to look into.

The Mammoth P Microbes sound like little pot farmers just trying to do there part. You've gotten me really interested in organic hydroponics. Not looking forward to the smells.

Thanks for the help and info!
Stoffel
You know you could get all those microbes and NPK from insect frass right?
NPK depends on the bugs used but it's cheap and very active in the fungi, benifitial side.
Mammoth microbes I helped myself to was £120 worth 3 X small 50 or 100ml
 

wisp

Active member
Offcourse in Coco work the same.

Coco Coir:

Cuttings / Seedlings / Low Feeding – Mix 10ml per Litre of Soil

Established Plants / High Feeding – Mix 20ml per Litre of Soil


Suitable for use in all potting mixes including coco coir, peat and peat-free potting soils.

For best results mix thoroughly with the potting substrate before planting. Follow up with top dressings every four weeks.
.
 
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Stoffel

Member
Offcourse in Coco work the same.

Coco Coir:

Cuttings / Seedlings / Low Feeding – Mix 10ml per Litre of Soil

Established Plants / High Feeding – Mix 20ml per Litre of Soil


Suitable for use in all potting mixes including coco coir, peat and peat-free potting soils.

For best results mix thoroughly with the potting substrate before planting. Follow up with top dressings every four weeks.
.
Will the insect frass effect my pumps and or drainage systems?
 

Stoffel

Member
Oh wait that releases npk over 3-4 weeks. If I was to start using organic it would be an complete system Feeding change. Sounds pretty daunting to maintain the specific levels I'm shooting for this way.
 

wisp

Active member
Oh wait that releases npk over 3-4 weeks. If I was to start using organic it would be an complete system Feeding change. Sounds pretty daunting to maintain the specific levels I'm shooting for this way.
You use it in the Coco, mix it in.
I use it with an 8 pot Wilma. (Used until this year)
Use it as a root boost and nutrient buffer.
Like Trichoderma is used in Canna.

I use Coco/clay mix for hydro, works fine. Will see if can find some pics.

EG.

 

MImedpatient

Well-known member
I have read this post 10 times and I'll probably read it another 20! I will definitely call them and have a chat first. My house smelling like rotten corn beef doesn't sound all that appealing however.

Do you have any source materials I can read or is this all trial and error I your part? I definitely notice a difference in seedling/veg with the Orca but honestly I don't think it's a big improvement like when I was in soil. I didn't know that bacteria beat out Microbes in hydro that's good info for.me to look into.

The Mammoth P Microbes sound like little pot farmers just trying to do there part. You've gotten me really interested in organic hydroponics. Not looking forward to the smells.

Thanks for the help and info!
Stoffel
don't be headinf down the organic hydro route, just use stuff like processed enzymes, and bacterial cultures . doing true hydro organic blends rather than stuff like the veg bloom which has heavily processed organic additives in it are different. I do not recommenced actual organic hydro until you have been growing awhile and have extra space to experiment.
the insect frass would need to be put into a nylon and suspended over an air stone or a n extra pump that is beating it around he reservoir to keep it from being too messy. like in the old grow guides they show the picture of a nylon of compost in a reservoir of a hydro system.

Lots of research can be found on google. type in "mycorrhizae hydroponics" and it should bring up lots of information to sift through. I do not have any links handy as I am not on my normal computer.
once its in water mammoth P doesn't smell and when cultured over night the piss smell doesn't propagate. its just the liquid its in smells like pee. like how Super thrive used to smell like a 90 year old man peed in a bucket and let it sit in the sun for a few days back before the inventor died. but doesnt transfer the smell to the reservoir.

The EM1 smells like slightly sulfured molasses wine. the tribus smells a little like feet, a little like cheese. also these liquids don't really add smell to a reservoir.

Bacteria, fungi, protists, archea are all microbes! and in organics its a hotly debated topic whether or not we truly have fungal or bacterial dominance in the soil at any given time. Supposedly ALL FEILD CROPS including cannabis, prefer bacterial dominance in the soil. but those of us of who have grown no till like to feed the fungus.

The mammoth P is a bunch of little hard working friends yes!
 

High-mish

Well-known member
I started using the nutrients from Age Old which are sold in a local grow shop.
I'm really happy with this line of nutes. Easier to get your hands on when you're in the US.

Just like Cannalicious, I'm also looking fwd to an update from @Stoffel
 

Stoffel

Member
Hey! Sorry for being gone! The last two weeks have been great. Had a hiccup where I got complacent and quit watching the rez, it evaped hard and spiked the solution to 3.7 but I caught it fast and have them down to 2.5 now. They smell so sweet. Can't wait to see whT yall think.
 

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MImedpatient

Well-known member
I can't keep.my head outta there. Soon as I noticed orange all my alarm bells went off lol. Flooded them with 7.0 ph 0 ec water.Changed the reservoir feeding water. My past blunders resulted in crop death soooooo I act quick now.
Same. it is one of the reasons I am excited to get back to big pot organics now that I have the LEDs and an AC. 30 gallon pot that takes 2 weeks to need water/compost tea , yes please.
 

Cannalicous

Active member
Can't wait to see whT yall think.
They look good. You know what I am thinking, a feed of EC 3 is just too much imho. That is what one would give to a plant few meters high :)
If you just give them what they ask, they really consume and get that consistency.
Rootstim, hydro a and b and booster is more then enough. If you change your water regulary and clean everything after each grow you don’t get a rotten smell. Never had it and I grow ebb and flow but flower aeroponics.
 

MImedpatient

Well-known member
They look good. You know what I am thinking, a feed of EC 3 is just too much imho. That is what one would give to a plant few meters high :)
If you just give them what they ask, they really consume and get that consistency.
Rootstim, hydro a and b and booster is more then enough. If you change your water regulary and clean everything after each grow you don’t get a rotten smell. Never had it and I grow ebb and flow but flower aeroponics.
when I grew hydro, I loved individual DWC buckets. I had an extra set so I could quickly switch to clean buckets every week for fertilizer change.
 

Cannalicous

Active member
when I grew hydro, I loved individual DWC buckets. I had an extra set so I could quickly switch to clean buckets every week for fertilizer change.
Yeah I can imagine how convienent it is. I had a Black Domina cutting in a dwc to try it once, just to see where hydro would take me. It was succes from the first time. I switched because I live small and soil is not convinient in my situation. I later switched to an entire aeroponics system though. I wanted to install a RDWC system, but choose differently. Still have 2 pots of 11L liter soil for cbd and edibles, zero fertilizer (batmix).

Critical Mass is in a rootpouch of 12L to treat semi ebb and flow (Mapito medium).
Might place her online in a different topic as this is about Gelato. Sorry Stoffel :D
 

Stoffel

Member
40 days into flower. The full extent of the complacency damage is visible now. I didn't remove it. Rez is at 1.8 ec. I figured after botching so bad and basically kneecapping them in the sprint I'd let them just relax.
 

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