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  #1  
Old 04-06-2009, 10:22 AM
Amoril's Avatar
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Default Male selection

I know theres a couple of threads on the subject, but in my browsing I havent seen this mentioned, so I wonder what others think

ive read some articles from a breeder who selects males on various criteria (of course) but has a unique requirement / rating category : time to display sex and initiate flowering.

but not the fastest...this breeder searches for the slowest to initiate flowering. The idea is that, naturally, the quickest males to flower are the most vigorous overall, and he feels that these traits tend to support more of the fibrous hemp than the drug-type cannabis.

However, the slower plants are less vigorous, fibrous, and have a higher need for the terpenoid systems for defense...which could lead to more cannabinoids.

The logic seems to flow to me, but then I wonder if anyone has actually experimented with it? Specifically, was hoping Shanti may have some insight, but any thoughts are invited....

if it were in fact valid, it would also pose the question for females, for similar reasons.
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  #2  
Old 04-06-2009, 11:01 AM
Joe King Park's Avatar
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Default Texas Heather Male

I Once Grew Ten TRC Texas Heathers
9 Turned Female
And One Male
Question ; How Long Does Pollen Remain Viable In A Frozen State ??
I Almost , At First Mistook This Male For A Female , But Removed It In Time
Want To Maybe Cross Pollinate , Or Give Away This Extinct Strain To Experienced Breeder
Joe
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  #3  
Old 04-06-2009, 11:55 AM
BAMBI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe King Park View Post
I Once Grew Ten TRC Texas Heathers
9 Turned Female
And One Male
Question ; How Long Does Pollen Remain Viable In A Frozen State ??
I Almost , At First Mistook This Male For A Female , But Removed It In Time
Want To Maybe Cross Pollinate , Or Give Away This Extinct Strain To Experienced Breeder
Joe

Good question, how long will pollen last in a dried but frozen state,?

I just bagged some up yesterday and put it inside a air tight container and will use some in about 1 months time, yet how long will the rest last frozen was the only question on my mind, ? - maybe 1 year im thinking. ?
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Old 04-06-2009, 05:07 PM
herbmister
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Great thead Amoril

iv just made the "witch male to select"descion

but before i read your post i mentaly went for the fastest male but wat you say makes sence..

i havent made and moves but out of three males i have of the malana one is smaller and slower than the other two

mmmmm interesting

herb
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  #5  
Old 04-07-2009, 02:12 AM
Amoril's Avatar
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yeah Herbmeister, im going to have to pick 4 males instead of 2 this year I think.

I was going with 1 x Sensi Star male, and 1 x Black Widow male to collect pollen from, and maybe keep a cut around for a while.

but now, I may pick two from each, and compare the kids. See which is more potent on average...the faster to flower, or slow? Surely I know there will be other factors, but since I dont have all the space in the world to work with, it should be enough to let me decide if I want to continue down that road or not.

Anyone else have any thoughts?
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Old 04-07-2009, 05:21 AM
Scorpion
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Originally Posted by Amoril View Post
yeah Herbmeister, im going to have to pick 4 males instead of 2 this year I think.

I was going with 1 x Sensi Star male, and 1 x Black Widow male to collect pollen from, and maybe keep a cut around for a while.

but now, I may pick two from each, and compare the kids. See which is more potent on average...the faster to flower, or slow? Surely I know there will be other factors, but since I dont have all the space in the world to work with, it should be enough to let me decide if I want to continue down that road or not.

Anyone else have any thoughts?
hi mate,
have a read here http://www.mrnice.nl/dhtml/media_articles.php
some excellent information about selective breeding.

peace
scorpion
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Old 04-07-2009, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
hi mate,
have a read here http://www.mrnice.nl/dhtml/media_articles.php
some excellent information about selective breeding.

peace
scorpion
thanks man, i think ive glanced at that before, but I gave it a read again

however, it just says that he and his friend selected for the best males and females based on a set of criteria....no real mention of those criteria.

I know its not likely that shanti would disclose his complete processes for selection, those are trade secrets of sorts...I just want to know if the theory that slow-to-flower males, or plants in general, typically produce more potent offspring. Or if there is a correlation at all.

and/or, how this would relate to other criteria. Should male floral cluster density be rated more importantly? What about aromas...i know this has been mentioned before as a good tell. Aroma just stems from the terpenoids, and I would think that could be effected by overall vigor...plants that are more finicky would require more defense systems....maybe.

its just that the only information ive found on this is from one source
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Old 04-07-2009, 06:50 AM
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Talking What A Coincidence

You Mentioned Sensi Star
I Once Crossed A Sensi Star With A Romulan , And Named It Romstar
It's A Coincidence Since Here Are The Texas Heathers Sharing The Same Tent As Two Romstar Clones
It Was My First ( And Last Go At Breeding )
Best Left For The Experts I Thought
It Was Good Though
Joe
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  #9  
Old 04-08-2009, 08:42 AM
Scorpion
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Originally Posted by Amoril View Post
thanks man, i think ive glanced at that before, but I gave it a read again

however, it just says that he and his friend selected for the best males and females based on a set of criteria....no real mention of those criteria.

I know its not likely that shanti would disclose his complete processes for selection, those are trade secrets of sorts...I just want to know if the theory that slow-to-flower males, or plants in general, typically produce more potent offspring. Or if there is a correlation at all.

and/or, how this would relate to other criteria. Should male floral cluster density be rated more importantly? What about aromas...i know this has been mentioned before as a good tell. Aroma just stems from the terpenoids, and I would think that could be effected by overall vigor...plants that are more finicky would require more defense systems....maybe.

its just that the only information ive found on this is from one source
hi amoril,
shanti has said he doesnt keep any secrets when it comes to breeding plants,
and has on many occasions revealed alot of special information.
mainly the selection is a process of trial and error until success is acheived...
you must grow the progeny,
while maintaining copies of mothers and fathers...
that is it in a nut shell.
sounds simple but in reality it takes time and space and a really good eye for the plant.
my personal feelings are to stay far away from unknown seed sources and absolutly NO Feminised Plants!
also if you really want to produce something to call "your own work" start with an inbred or landrace that is of high quality... Walkabout is a cheap place to search for those types of seed as are other places.
its really easy to make seed,but requires alot of work to produce
your own f1 hybrid
but thats just how I feel and everyone has their own thoughts on that.

good luck with your work, I have alot of fun with it.

peace scorpion
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  #10  
Old 04-09-2009, 05:55 AM
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yeah, Im going to just have to try it out. Problem is, its going to take me years of testing progeny to draw conclusions of that magnitude.

Im hoping someone has noticed a correlation....let me try a more clear example

Male A and Male B. We'll assume pollination of the same mother for simplicity. Male plants are from the same seedstock, and display similar phenotypic characteristics (height, distance per node, leaf structure shape and size, etc...). The only noticable difference between the two males is....

Male A shows sex at approximately 5wks from germination.

Male B shows sex approximately 2 weeks later, coming in at 7wks.

Both plants are grown side by side, so its safe to say plant B shows sex more slowly. Can any conclusions upon potency of the plants be determined at this point?

the article I read would suggest that offspring from the Male B line would tend to be more potent. Im hoping someone with more experience in selection (Ive got a restricted grow, not really a good base to draw substantial conclusions)
can shed some light on whether or not there is a link,

and if so, which way they observed. Im likely to believe the theory holds water, but im open to the idea that there really is no link upon such simple concepts. Just seems the logic behind it is moderately complete.

Last edited by Amoril; 04-09-2009 at 06:01 AM.
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