Neville's Haze Indoor

socioecologist

New member
This time of year in the Pacific Northwest can be awfully gloomy if you're not ready for it. In my valley, the clouds form thick carpets of black-flecked gray while rolling in from the Pacific, get bunched up and tickled while traversing the Coast Range, and pelt the long, wide valley with rain 9 months out of the year. It's dark, damp, stormy...and a relentlessly long season. No one has outdone Ken Kesey's Sometimes a Great Notion for describing the symbiosis that has to develop between person and place for one to thrive in the PNW through the seemingly never-ending rainy-season; Bernard Malmud tried--and I'm no Bernard Malmud--so I won't even try.

However, I will say this: I'm not surprised that DJ Short developed his blue lines in Oregon. If the fuzzy green herb is part of your PNW survival toolkit, you have to select for kind and uplifting varieties to maintain your sanity.

Back to the "why are we here?" question. In the winter, instead of the usual mountain biking or trail running, I spend a lot of time walking with my dog in the coastal rainforest that surrounds my tiny patch of suburban fringe. This can involve ingesting THC before hand. My favorite strains for this line of leisure are strongly uplifting, encourage visual and auditory perception shifts, are long-lasting, provide a low-dose amphetamine-like increase in brain reaction/creativity, and stimulate deep introspection. I've done what I can to keep varieties that provide these great experiences, which, for me, are symbiotically matched with our weather. In my admittedly short search (~5 years), two particular lines have continued to stand out: DJ Short's blues and the MNS Haze lines. It seems like anything that is touched by either of these lines turns out good ratios of great experiences. Having never grown Neville's Haze--the closest it seems we can get to the old lines--it seemed like the logical choice for my winter indoor grow.

I've loved reading the great N. Haze threads while waiting for flowers to emerge on mine, taking pointers from some great, experienced sativa growers. Now that the flowers are starting to form (about 5.5 weeks in to flower), I wanted to share some of the growing experience so far and see if anyone would like to comment on phenotypes.

I'll post some pictures and growing information in a few hours. It's my dog's 7th birthday and I promised him a long walk in the forest. It's noon and he's pissed that we're not already in the mountains. One more bag of Super Silver Haze (for me) and a shot of one Neville's Haze (for everyone) before I go...
 

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Very nice post, I love the way you express the reasons you enjoy yourself while under the influence of mother nature's gift. :) More people need to understand the ranges and mood shifts this plant can give us, and like you describe, deep introspective thinking which just isn't possible without a little aid from mother nature herself.

Beautiful post, makes me want to take my dog for a walk! I'm balls deep in snow right now though lol.
 
Sometimes a great notion

"Ken Kesey's-Sometimes a Great Notion" one of my all time favorite books. Your writting makes me want to read it again, and soon. I too have a long season of being indoors and Nevilles Haze is in my future for next year. I look forward to seeing your experiences with it.

Peace
 
My favorite strains for this line of leisure are strongly uplifting, encourage visual and auditory perception shifts, are long-lasting, provide a low-dose amphetamine-like increase in brain reaction/creativity, and stimulate deep introspection. I've done what I can to keep varieties that provide these great experiences... In my admittedly short search (~5 years), two particular lines have continued to stand out: DJ Short's blues and the MNS Haze lines.

Hi Socioecologist! Peace!

Yeah that quoted & underlined above!!!!!!!

For my next purchase hopefully Summer 2011 for Winter 2011/12 seed/breeding grows (vs. Spring/Summer Sinsemilla grows), I am considering Neville's Haze or DJ Short's FLO for those reasons you so beautifully articulate above - I enjoy the same kinds of qualities in my Sativa-leaning strains. And WOW-ZAZ on the Shupa Shilva Hazhe! Just like back in Amsterdam, a truly uplifting and cerebral introspective strain full of energy. The energy could just as easily be channeled by extroverts for social or dance avenues.

Wow, 5.5 weeks to start to see flowers? If you would be so kind, pls let us know when you first started to see pistils and/or preflowers(?). This kind of strain will be hard for me to grow b/c I usually pick at my plants to allow others to live to full harvest (when I don't have dried stash). A long harvest may make this an impossibility, or at the very least a difficulty that will be a challenge to bring a plant to full harvest.

Thanks.

Peace!
 
beautifully written post Soceologist, it was a joy to read.

tell your dog we said Happy B-day.

sometimes there's nothing more therapeutic than a walk with the dog to face the winter blues head-on by getting out in the thick of it. definitely not an everyday thing but your dog's b-day is certainly reason enough. ;)
 
Winds from the East

Thanks for the kind words. I plan on sharing the experience of growing this Neville's Haze as much as I can. I love comparing experiences, so please feel free to join in. Let's share some of those experiences described above and the plants that manifested them--plants Neville has said carry "presence".

As a friend said, you are smoking away and suddenly it feels like God has come into the room. I call it presence.

For me, this "presence" is a palpable experience of self-awareness--the seen but unseen are revealed and your place--temporary, ephemeral, insignificant, but here and now--within your environment are made clear. The clarity is, for me, often enhanced by immersion in nature ("as people-less as possible," I often tell myself before heading out; though truly kind herb invokes a genuine feeling of positive surprise in the chance encounters with other people). After a few hours of work, today landed a sample of unknown lineage in my vaporizer. Not the interdimensional-communication augmentation of yesterday's Super Silver Haze, but definitely uplifting and kind. It yielded the following results:

The sun peeled back the clouds this morning. The wind changed directions. The ominous electric-black dampness of yesterday seems like a dream, replaced by a pack of mis-shapen (but obviously domesticated) cottonballs in gentle migration to warmer pastures in the south. A casual observer or new transplant might take this changing of the guard as a sign: the valley, which from a high enough vantage point no less than 12 hours ago resembled a dark corner of Picasso's "Guernica," is baring its gentle pastoral soul for all to see. No one is falsely experiencing this overwhelming brightness and vitality, this effervescent outpouring of the valley's winter duality. There is nothing stark about the landscape. The warmth of the sun leaves nothing to be desired. The temperature will rise to 53F, bringing to life small flying insects, flocks of birds, new shoots on hardy plants, and many of the hibernating homo economicus. The empty parking area of the mountain I walked with my dog yesterday has 10 SUVs packed into it today. The town and weather--it seems--have gone manic in their own interrelated way.

Attached Image: Overwintering Geese, Convinced That Blue Sky in PNW = Time to Head North
 

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Scenes from 4000 Feet

Attachment 1: Entering the Forest
Attachment 2: Native Ferns Imitating Vertical Gardens
Attachment 3: Presence
Attachment 4: Reward--Sunshine and a Stick
 

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Interplay Between Organism and Environment

I germinated 18 Neville's Haze seeds on Nov. 3rd, 2010. 17 survived. They were vegged in 16oz. beer cups (Black Gold potting soil) under 150w of CFL lighting (105w 6700K / 45w 3400K) for 2.5 weeks @ 24/0, then transplanted into 1 gallon smart pots with coco coir and poorly top-fed with tea. They spent the next 3 weeks under a 1000w HPS lamp (24/0).

During this time, a simple organism/environment interaction dominated the development of these 17 plants: the deliverer of nutrients (me) was afraid of burning these delicate, whispy tropical sativas and so held back--way back--on food deliveries. I wish they would have thrown a brick at me, like the floods of people on the streets of Tunisia, Mozambique, Egypt, and Bangladesh who need food and have run out of options. But plants don't have arms, bricks, or access to either. They do, like everything on our big blue ball, have the ability to communicate with other species. The organisms who communicate well with others are successful.

So long as others are listening and responding in a mutually beneficial way. I was not--and I owe them an apology. The 17 plants survived this rocky stretch of our time together, but were not thriving. This maltreatment continued for several weeks after changing the light regime to 11/13, until all plants had shown their sex. 8 boys, 9 girls. Cuttings of each girl were taken, and the ladies-from-seed were immediately transplanted into 2.5 gallon nursery pots with my first bag of FFOF (I never thought I would buy pre-mixed dirt), and given their own 5x5 footprint under a 1000w MH. The boys were segregated, but allowed to continue flowering long enough to collect some pollen from each, then put back on a 24/0 light regime with plenty of nutrients.

The ladies exploded in their new dirt and light. Night and day difference. Lesson learned. They're not that delicate. And FFOF isn't bad for this stage of flowering. They're now 6 weeks into the flip, and starting to take form. 7 of the plants have a similar flower structure, leaf shape, and rate of flowering emerging, each which resemble attachment #1 in structure. There is one visibly larger yielding version of this phenotype (attachment 2). The final plant is the most compact of the group, but stacking resinous calyxes over very resinous fan leaves (attachment 3). One of the seven dominant phenotypes shares the leaf structure (but not bud structure) and high resin fan-leaves.

These two resin hounds share a strong orange-citrus oil with an effervescent undertone--as if it were partially carbonated. That feel--partial carbonation?--has been present in some of my favorite plants--there was just something about how they tickled my nose. They all are (or were, RIP) strong in the attention they command within you and the augmentation they provide. The smell also reminds me of a deceased SSH keeper, my ten week prom queen who excelled as a reality adulterant when used in combination with vigorous outdoor activities--just enough body to ward off pain, an electric uptick in response, sociable, and vision-widening (my mountain biking descents are always 16:9 letter-boxed on her). Resin hasn't made a grand entrance for the others--more on this as they continue to mature.
 

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7 Weeks of Flowering

The nine ladies just finished their 49th day flowering; the good smells are starting to waft and the resin's flowing. These are all exceptional looking and smelling plants--and very unique in both departments from any other variety I've grown (outside of SSH). Early vaporizer tests of resiny leaves have left me very relaxed, with good visual distortions with heightened hearing. Very enjoyable and strong effect for this early in flower--though it's heavier (body) than I expected.

There is one plant in particular that I can't stop staring at. The calyxes look identical to my old SSH keeper (they share a very similar scent as well). The flowers are huge with an unmistakable turquoise sheen, the pistils a fiery orange--they look cartoonish. I think I might be in love.
 

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Day 57

Just finished up week 8, headed for week 9. Sweet spice/incense is the smell in most of the nine plants right now--it reminds me of mangos and play-doh. I've found one with a full black pepper note upfront (sweet undertone). There are two NL leaning phenos that are really packing on the flowers (more citrus in the nose of these). The others appear a few weeks behind on thickening up, but the buds are definitely starting to take shape.

Could anyone offer their experience with phenotype ratios with this strain?

I had a mite and powdery mildew outbreak in my main flowering area (from some gifted plants), so the NH was moved into a 2'x4' tent with a 1000w HPS. At this point I'm cutting any fan leaves with PM and delicately spraying with a neem mixture to control the bugs. Hoping to make it to the finalé, but this will not be the perfect grow I wanted to give to these women.

Cuttings of each were transplanted to 1 gallon containers this morning and will get re-run after this batch finishes. Hopefully I can figure out which one to use outdoors this summer.

On to the pictures. Comments, feedback, experiences, etc. are welcomed!
 

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A Little Help from Nev

Just ran across some interesting information in the "SSH, Sour D, Jack Herer All the Same" thread and wanted to solicit opinions from the more experienced.

The JH came out of a batch that made before ending up in jail. My ex manager grew this batch out when I was in jail or shortly after I got out (so he told me). It was a stand out indica type reminisent of the NL5. It was quick too, 8 weeks. Most of the siblings were stretchy sativa types. I tested the same batch again, but didn't find another one. If you do the numbers with something with even 25% NL5, you will find types that lean to the NL5. This was one. They pop up in the NH too, but until now they haven't been the best ones.
N.

(my emphasis)

I'm wondering what that means in regards to the short, dense, fast flowering NH I keep drooling on. I'm also curious to know what "until now they haven't been the best ones" is referring to...? (edited: Smoked a bowl and thought a bit--maybe it's not about NL5 leaning women at all. Pure speculation--and I'm blissfully high--but is this a reference to the male NH sought/held for the grail project?)

And one more helpful bit of advice from Nevil:

At least HzA still lives through the NH. But I do regret loosing it prematurely.
Worse was loosing the First Haze female. She was similar in type to HzA, but I suspect a generation earlier. In my mind, it was the Haze archetype. I should have put HzA to that plant. There wasn't anything sweet about FH (First Haze), like the progeny from HzA, she was spicy leathery and people would often recoil if they came into a room where you had been smoking it.
The Haze C was sweeter and generally a better breeding plant because of this, otherwise C and A were equal in quality. HzA hybrids could yield more. In the NH, HzC accounts for 50% of the genetics, yet the predominant good pheno is the HzA type.
I would say that both A and C were from a sibling to FH and I'd guess that the true OH prior to '69 is the spicy leather type which I associate with the Chocolate Buddha Thai of the early'70s. The F1 NH is a time capsule, throwing back to the past glories of the S.E Asian masters IMO. We must use it well.

(my emphasis)

Sounds like Nev views the HzA (spice instead of sweet, leather) as the best representation of NH. Has that been others' experience as well?
 
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The first pic and the fourth look like the keepers to me...nice mix, and look like they will actually finish:D..good shit bro
 
Great Thread

I really like this thread and your writing style. I wish I had something to contribute but all I can do is wish you well. Subscribed!:cool:
 
Inversions: Time and Place

Thanks longhorn--the first pic in that set is the one I've been watching most intensely. Half the resin-heads are translucent already, and the (seed) plant's @ 61 days. I'm excited to run a few more of her next time.

Scrog, thanks for the kind words. Yours is a big contribution for me--it let me know I'm not just babbling to myself.:)

On to babbling?

Signs and weather are temporary. The best laid plans, models, hopes, dreams, and--of course--ships are bound to be smashed upon rocks if captains assume that the course to safe passage is unchanging. To plot a viable path, the astute navigator needs to consider all the forces--some conscious or visible, others not--between present-position and desired future-position. The powdery mildew and mites have thrown me for a loop, but I hope to salvage the remnants of a great first 9 weeks of flowering. But there are larger forces bearing down on all of us, often signaled with shifting winds.

Take this recent case of sunny weather here in my valley. Redirecting the coastal conveyor requires significant energy, an energy that only builds a few times over the winter and requires small creek climate zones to briefly harmonize with the massive Columbia river watershed through the natural amplification of the Columbia River Gorge. The Columbia River is a giant liquid energy flow, originating in glaciers in the Rocky Mountain range of British Columbia. It's flow over millions of years, with the assistance of over 40 massive floods from Glacial Lake Missoula, carved the natural wonder we call "the Gorge". A strong East wind follows the river through the Gorge, making the area home to some of the world's largest wind farms and best windsurfing/kiteboarding.

The gorge is home to a particularly tough and taciturn lot, many who stoically farm commodity crops more commonly acceptable by polite society. These people work as long as the job requires, attend church, and warily send their children to small government outpost schools, all while teetering on the edge of economic calamity caused by monopoly forces in US agribusiness. The East wind carries the unfortunate refuse of 20th century mistakes from the Hanford Nuclear Reservation and the Umatilla Weapons Depot through the gorge, picking up the top soil and petrochemicals from the stoic farmers--as well as a bit of their malaise towards change--depositing it all further down the river/energy channel (especially in the Superfund zone of Portland, the West's "greenest" city).

But back to that sunny weather. When the ground heats around the massive watersheds feeding the Columbia, the dense, cold air sinks with snow melt all the way to the gorge, providing (when conditions are right) a dramatic surge to the East wind's power. For a few days, the East wind is strong enough to follow the ancient Lake Missoula bursts up the Willamette river and into the giant Willamette valley, diverting the onshore flow from the Pacific further south, and trapping all those particulates between the Coast Range and Cascades in a stagnating inversion. We receive delightful sunshine but wallow in the exhalations of industry. And it's not just the particulates that science can see: the stagnant air advisories should be amended to include warnings of reactionary culture, flowing from the stoic farmers through the charged city of Portland. The valley dwellers go manic with the descending sun rays, heading outdoors, staying up too late, and generally adopting Per Hansa's Scandinavian madness--all the while knowing something is afoul. The malaise of middle Oregon farmland creeps into the collective unconscious, and thousands cry out: "Enough. Now is not the time or place. Bring back what is comfortable. What is expected. What is necessary for survival. Give us back our conservative: make it rain."

The sun disappeared behind a curtain of grey today. The moss is no longer crying out. The rhythm of February life has returned, first with a few drip-drops, soon with a staccatissimo deluge. Play on nature.
 
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Day 64

The week 9 update is here. I snipped a small sample from each plant to dry and test next week. Two plants have an orange-citrus-funk mixed with good aftershave (#2 and #4), two more have a fantastic pine-lime smell (#1 and #5) more on this in a second), and the other five are varying levels of spice--this should start maturing more in the coming weeks. When I grew SSH a couple years ago, I only ended up with two females out of 18 seeds; one was in the orange-citrus-funk family (big yields, beautiful buds, memorable high) and the other smelled IDENTICAL to the two pine-lime females from this NH batch. I'm shocked by the similarities in aroma between the SSH females and half of the NH--it should be expected I guess, but it's still pretty cool.

I had a wave of fear and apprehension hit me when I smelled the pine-lime phenos this morning; I didn't keep the SSH female with the similar smell, though it was the smoothest smoke I've ever inhaled. The smell, taste, and smoke were exotic, but every session put me completely over the edge (sometimes good, usually bad, but always a mentally/emotionally taxing experience). I came to fear that plant for it's raw power. It will be interesting to see if there is concordance between smell and trip.
 

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hahahah..wish i could find a plant i was scared of due to its pure power...you have inspired me to buy atleast one pack of each: NH, ssh, and mango bc i hear nothing but great things about it
 
Week 10: To Balance. Cheers.

Been smoking samples all week; fantastic high, unique flavors, but not quite peak potency yet. I wish I had enough to smoke Nev's Haze each session...my favorite looker (attachment #1 and #2) smokes similarly to a "Western Winds" female I used to keep (pretty obvious what that line is derived from, eh?), but stronger flavor; it's a cedar funk smoke, clear high but occasionally disorienting, and comes with an indica-dominant plant structure (very short, close internodes) and stringy foxtail buds. Love it. When you smoke it, have your walking shoes on because you're going on a journey (see attached Jung note).

The plants are finally starting to signal an end--some fan leaves are dropping off, resin heads are turning opaque silver en masse, and the buds are swelling. The quicker plants have turned their pistils orange and bulked up in the last week, while the ultra-distance runners are still throwing new flowers each day; I'll let them go until the resin looks right or environmental conditions force me to take them down.

Don't know if it was my current location in life or the Haze, but I required some Jung to pull back from the depths this week (The Red Book: pg. 238):

Take note of what the ancients taught us in images: madness is divine. But because the ancients lived this image concretely in events, it became a deception for us, since we became masters of the reality of the world. It is unquestionable: if you enter into the world of the soul, you are like a madman, and a doctor would consider you to be sick. What I say here can be seen as sickness, but no one can see it as sickness more than I do.

This is how I overcame madness. If you do not know what divine madness is, suspend judgement and wait for the fruits. But know that there is a divine madness which is nothing other than the overpowering of the spirit of this time through the spirit of the depths. Speak then of sick delusion when the spirit of the depths can no longer stay down and forces a man to speak in tongues instead of in human speech, and makes him believe that he himself is the spirit of the depths. But also speak of sick delusion when the spirit of this time does not leave a man and forces him to see only the surface, to deny the spirit of the depths and to take himself for the spirit of the times. The spirit of this time is ungodly, the spirit of the depths is ungodly, balance is godly.
 

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Great description

... The smell, taste, and smoke were exotic, but every session put me completely over the edge (sometimes good, usually bad, but always a mentally/emotionally taxing experience). I came to fear that plant for it's raw power. It will be interesting to see if there is concordance between smell and trip.

I can really appreciate this description. As I was doing the smoke report for my La Niña (Mullumbimby Madness x Black Widow) thread, this is EXACTLY how I felt. Especially the mentally/emotionally taxing part. I didn't want the review to sound negative but I think it's important we always report the truth as accurately as possible without embellishment. I wonder how much of this type of experience relates to the individual's tolerance to haze or sativa varieties in general? What I found to be a mentally overwhelming smoke might be perfect to those with a high tolerance for sativas. Most of my smoking life, I have smoked indica dominant hybrids but perhaps after a year or so of smoking sativa's I would come back to this strain and have an entirely different experience.

Anyways, enough rambling. Keep up the great work and keep pouring your thoughts into this thread. It's a breath of fresh air!
 
Hello socioecologist,

I love your writing style, it makes me think I'm missing a large portion of my vocabulary. :p :rolleyes: :p

I just read yer thread here and it's given me some inspiration to obtain some of these genetics sooner rather than later. IDK if I can handle the flower times of the NH but I've got my eye on the MHz and the SSH for future purchase.

Your pics are great too. Pics don't do a whole lot for me but I do like looking at em and dreaming. Keep up the great work man! Subscribed as well!


Also your descriptions of the "George has me wanting to get back up there again. I've been in a much drier portion of the country for a while now and would like to get back to some humid air and squishy forest floors. :D :D
 
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