Root-bound males and autoflowering tendencies

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
Last month a knowledgeable friend came by my place for a visit and to share genetics and he made a passing comment that stuck with me. He said that male cannabis plants have a tendency to autoflower when they are root bound. I hadn't heard this but it rung true, as I remember my Angel's Breath keeper male was throwing pollen in the veg cabinet under a 16-hour light regimen before I lost him. He was definitely root bound at the time. Then I thought about D4, the sole male from my run of The Doors last year, and how he flowered before all the females, and how at the time I simply chalked it up to his being a very early flowering male. Now that I think about it, that plant was definitely root bound when it started producing staminate flowers, so maybe it wasn't necessarily an early flowering male but maybe it was autoflowering due to it's small container.

Is this tendency a known thing? Does this mean that I have to be constantly cloning and replacing any males I keep if I want to keep them in veg?
 
Root RESTRICTION (not pruning).

Not unusual for big sativa lines to show a dislike root restriction.
If they get root-bound they can see it as a threat to survival, it can trigger production of flowers as the plant tries to preserve the species.

Understanding that, you can manage it with regular brutal pruning to keep the veg mass above soil small enough for a small container root system to provide for.
You'll never prune a plant more aggressively, because pollen flying from a misbehaving male can be a real issue. Chop chop chop to make a big plant small. It's good to see how much these plants can really take. Good reason to practice your cloning skills too.

At the same time, knowing you can trigger your male to flower by letting it grow too big for it's container is something that might come in useful some day. I mean, the reason you keep a male at all is to produce seeds right?

Wide leaf's seem to be less sensitive to this, but I assume a pheno from any cannabis line could potentially demonstrate this behavior.
 
Last edited:
Uhh,no.

Its VERY common for some of us old school growers to take a 10 year old mother (or father) and just pull the whole plant and soil from a container and a large pair of scissors and whack away at the rootball then put back into the container with some fresh soil.
(Over run sentance but wtf?).

I've been doing it since at least the 80's.
I still have a 27 year old bonzai'd mother chocolate thai that has been trimmed top AND bottom dozens of times.
I'm not the only one doing it....I'm sure you can find tons of howtos on it all over the interwebz.....clicky clicky.
 
Uhh,no.

Its VERY common for some of us old school growers to take a 10 year old mother (or father) and just pull the whole plant and soil from a container and a large pair of scissors and whack away at the rootball then put back into the container with some fresh soil.
(Over run sentance but wtf?).

I've been doing it since at least the 80's.
I still have a 27 year old bonzai'd mother chocolate thai that has been trimmed top AND bottom dozens of times.
I'm not the only one doing it....I'm sure you can find tons of howtos on it all over the interwebz.....clicky clicky.

You answered 1 of 2 different questions.
I answered why/if it happens (his first question) what to do about it. I left out root pruning (which is a good option I have used many times myself.)
You only answered the second without any explanation.

I thought when you said pruning, you were incorrectly answering the first question.
You have any 10 year old fathers around these days?
 
Last edited:
The thing is.....to think before jumping to conclusions.

A seed plant has a main tap root, a clone does not.
Hmm...y'all following yet ?

Any sat worth a shit will hit 8 foot tall above ground, and at least 4 foot of tap root depth.
Don't believe it ? Carefully dig down to the end of the main tap root of a in ground planted sativa after harvest, you'll probably be thinking all about China when you see how much root a plant really puts down.

I've known for decades that a tall/slender planter will produce better than a short squat one.
I suggest everyone experiments along these lines in order to increase both plant health and yields.
Tall kitchen trash cans are ideal...7 gallons are my go to.
You can also put way more square shaped containers in a given space (no wasted empty floor space around the circle shaped units)

Meh, whatever....figure it out your own damn selves....or dont.
I really dont care any more.
I'm done trying to teach shit anymore.
Make mistakes, it's the best way for rock heads to learn
 
My ghash males auto if kept in small pots also my old sweetooth#3 mum used to auto when root bound it made her a nightmare to keep.;)
 
Last edited:
This is a really cool thread, on an important topic.
Thank you to all for great input.

So it appears that everyone agrees that stress caused by root binding will cause auto-sexing.

Also, everyone seems to agree that root pruning is a valid/valuable technique.
#Rocket pots may be useful.

So anyone got any hints on a good technique to prune?
I learned to take of the bottom 50mm/2" and fillet off two sides. Leaving a wedge of about 100mm/4".
Next year you take off the fillets on the opposing sides, leaving the root zone in a square of 10*10cm over the two seasons

Really good heads-up on the ST3. I'm about to germ some ST3X, and the fact it throws a heap of root sounds good, as she should throw a bunch of bloom also.

N2ishun, really cool theory/observation about running deeper rather than wider pots.
Do you think this holds true for cuts, as well as seed plants, or it's just the original that benefits from the tap-root depth?
 
Just my opinion based on my experience growing weed since 1972, but I do not agree that root bound or root stressed plants bloom earlier or differently. As for "auto" or early blooming from cramped roots, I have not seen that. With landraces or with modern hybrids. From seed or from clones. Though I have never needed to clone males. I only grow standard photos. No autos or fems. I bonsai (root bind) my males as I do not need gobs of pollen. I size them up to 2 gallon pots max, whereas I size up females to 15 gallon pots. The males tend to start blooming slightly earlier than females, but that is the same with full size males which I have also grown in the ground in different years.

I have also seen claims that Mediterranean varieties like Lebanese red are "autos", or partial autos because they bloom earlier and finish in September. But that is not the case. They are true photos, and they just bloom with less decrease in day length. As opposed to say SE Asian or Colombian strains that bloom way later with a large decrease in day length. Either of these strains can be forced to bloom when light deprived. I have forced blooming with light dep for some decades now.

I have also found that bushy pinched/topped plants or bent stem plants will produce more weed than if they are left tall and slender. Many have noted this growing here in the west US, so it is a common commercial practice. Its an energy thing. More sunlight falls on a wider area. Simple physics. More sun, more sugars for the plant. The plants also stay more compact and easier to manage, spray and harvest. And here you have to keep home grows out of public sight, so tall plants are just not an option for many. I grow in greenhouses so I have to pinch my plants to keep them lower growing. Otherwise they get to 12 feet and become too hard to manage and they touch the greenhouse ceiling and rot from condenstation.

As for the "my way to the highway" posts here... get real. None of us is as smart as all of us. And there are many different methods to grow plants. If you think we are all as dumb as bags of rocks, you just sound like Mr Ego himself, Dave Watson. Seriously.
 
Last edited:
So...

When is the last time you physically dug up ALL the roots from an in ground planted 8 foot sativa ?

Yep, never, or you'd know.
 
Just my opinion based on my experience growing weed since 1972, but I do not agree that root bound or root stressed plants bloom earlier or differently. As for "auto" or early blooming from cramped roots, I have not seen that. With landraces or with modern hybrids. From seed or from clones. Though I have never needed to clone males. I only grow standard photos. No autos or fems. I bonsai (root bind) my males as I do not need gobs of pollen. I size them up to 2 gallon pots max, whereas I size up females to 15 gallon pots. The males tend to start blooming slightly earlier than females, but that is the same with full size males which I have also grown in the ground in different years.

I have also seen claims that Mediterranean varieties like Lebanese red are "autos", or partial autos because they bloom earlier and finish in September. But that is not the case. They are true photos, and they just bloom with less decrease in day length. As opposed to say SE Asian or Colombian strains that bloom way later with a large decrease in day length. Either of these strains can be forced to bloom when light deprived. I have forced blooming with light dep for some decades now.

I have also found that bushy pinched/topped plants or bent stem plants will produce more weed than if they are left tall and slender. Many have noted this growing here in the west US, so it is a common commercial practice. Its an energy thing. More sunlight falls on a wider area. Simple physics. More sun, more sugars for the plant. The plants also stay more compact and easier to manage, spray and harvest. And here you have to keep home grows out of public sight, so tall plants are just not an option for many. I grow in greenhouses so I have to pinch my plants to keep them lower growing. Otherwise they get to 12 feet and become too hard to manage and they touch the greenhouse ceiling and rot from condenstation.

As for the "my way to the highway" posts here... get real. None of us is as smart as all of us. And there are many different methods to grow plants. If you think we are all as dumb as bags of rocks, you just sound like Mr Ego himself, Dave Watson. Seriously.
Are you still having hallucinations of scam the skankman hiding in every shadow you pass ?
Perhaps professional counseling should be in your direct future.
Seriously, seek help dude.
 
I don't talk shit, lol, so wouldn't have commented unless I know...Actually dug them up couple year ago for member on another forum.. from a plant that harvested just under four pound, 7' high, trained, 10' wide, 2' long turnip at most ... Photos are on 420mag, simple root search should bring pics up..
 
Hey Big Sur, excuse me for putting words in your mouth.
It was australia day yesterday, and also chinese new year.
That's what a belly full of rum punch will do to my concentration.

I'm not sure if wrestling is real , n2ishun, but it's OK to hate on the villains.

Do you think a taller pot, of same volume as a shorter one will yield better, even with a cutting?
Or is it just the seed plant?

Hey Growstone, hope you are doing well this season, and had a nice kick back yesterday
 
Last edited:
Gday Vlad, hope your well man.. worked yesterday, to finish a job.. spent today trying to avoid going over the handlebars on my mountain bike. Didn't succeed, lol..
 
Are you still having hallucinations of scam the skankman hiding in every shadow you pass ?
Perhaps professional counseling should be in your direct future.
Seriously, seek help dude.

Well, when it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and walks like a duck, it is usually a duck. You act just like Dave Watson, dude. And you are soooo sensitive to that analogy, I believe that I hit the mark with you. You are so full of shit and all knowing. Ego the size of Texas. You stomp off this forum and leave, then you pop up again later and tell everyone that they are all stupid morons. You seem to have a god complex. You have no clue, but you think you do. So that gets you labeled as Dave Watson. If you do not like it, too bad.

Rant on, man...
 
BigSur, no disrespect intended but you come across more like him than any other member I've read. Full of shit and all knowing sums you up perfectly.. what you hate about yourself you see in others? Your the president of your own fanclub, herm seed dreams.. again, no disrespect intended, just my opinion from my experience since '75..
 
Last edited:
FYI: from my hallucinatory experience: there are more than one phenotype for Cannabis roots. Some have large tap roots, some have small top roots or no tap roots with just a fibrous root ball instead. Clones generally have no tap roots and only a fibrous root ball grown from adventitious roots. Many indoor growers that I know prefer large wide growing pots over deep ones. As for pruning, it is well known that you can get a larger crop from pruning, bending, crushing, or twisting stems. It is commonly called pinching, bending, crushing, or supercropping, or high/low stress training of Cannabis.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top